Dear IRB,
A poser for you. A World Cup semi final is coming up, the joint 2nd most important game in the 4 year cycle. You are selecting match officials for the games.
In the quarter finals Wales defeat Ireland, and set up a game vs France in the semi final. With regards to this game, do you select
1) A South African Ref
2) A New Zealand Ref
3) An Aussie Ref
4) An English Ref
5) A half Irish, a half French ref
One wonders how such decisions are made
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It was perplexing to me that in the Aus-NZ game, there will be a South African ref, and in Wales-France, there was a Franco-Irish ref. Would it not have made more sense to have the Southern ref do the northern game, and vice-versa. I would like somebody from the IRB to explain this logic.
I think it might be that Wales had Joubert for the Ireland game and they didn’t want to give them the same ref two games in a row. And also i think they had to choose the two refs for the semi final who they were considering for the final. (dont know if thats correct, just my assumption)
Firstly, I may not be true, but to me it stinks of fixing in the same manner as that of which the Pakistan cricketers are accused. What do you thinks the odds would have been prior to the game of a Welsh player being sent off in the first half? 100/1 perhaps? Now I am not suggesting that this is truly what happened but the coincidences are redolent of such a thing having happened and it may be appropriate to determine whether such a bet was made, by whom and with whom. If such a bet was made and paid out then certain people have a question to answer. Secondly, I consider that the Welsh team and Welsh Rugby Union in general has been grossly insulted by this event and much scorn is heaped upon the IRB for actually banning the Captain of our international team instead of cancelling his red card.
Based on Sunday’s performance, and his job the entire tournament, I think Joubert is the right man to ref the final. I think he has been consistent thoughout.
I do not envy Alain Rolland the next time he referees a Magner’s League match in Wales.
The Welsh captain being sent off at an early stage in a match without real justification is going to effect the game one way or another.I think there is a real concerns into the extremely hasty decision made. I felt the red card was already in his hand before the tackle was even made? Rugby is (or at least should be) a physical and aggressive sport. When a player is hitting “man and ball” as Warburton was it is immensely difficult for him in a split second to react and gently bring the tackled player to the ground. He did as well as he could in the circumstances A yellow card was more appropriate and the whole course of the tournament was changed in that split second. I felt “flat” .The final will now be a horrible anticlimax with the French being deservedly thrashed by the Kiwis and i for one will be supporting the all blacks.
Come on Paul take your oil you lost
Just a Kiwi perspective here lads. Wales was robbed and the watching public was robbed of a fair game..It ruined the game for us Kiwis too. A yellow card maximum if at all.
Yes, Rolland’s over (and immediate) reaction suggested that he felt he had to show ‘em who was boss when fisticuffs broke out and he was surrounded by a lot of strapping french beasts indignantly demanding that something be done; he was intimidated. It was as if he wanted to stamp his authority on the match by brandishing the ultimate sanction under their noses all under the guise of “applying the letter of the law” Bah! Interestingly, he seemed to forget applying the letter of the law in the last 10 mins when he gave a penalty to wales which was rightfully france’s (the leigh hp kick). This suggested to me that he had realised the enormity of his stupid decision and tried to undo it by giving wales a chance to win which would then have relieved him of all responsibility of having effectively weighted the whole game in france’s favour. He knew that wales were the better side and that he had royally effed up in depriving them of their place in the final. If Wales had won, then all would be forgiven, it would be a glorious victory and he wouldn’t have to face the shitstorm that he knew would come were they to lose… but come it has. It is a travesty when a game is sacrificed in favour of a law. The laws are there to serve the game not the other way round otherwise the whole thing becomes self-defeating. Result – a triumph of mediocrity that is France.
I know under the laws the IRB could have banned Sam W for 6 weeks so 3 seems like they have considered and reviewed the actual event (unlike Alain, who had the opportunity to do so using the TMO but didn’t take it). I agree with Warren Gatland, Rugby is so much more than the rules, they are there to ensure fair play and safety for the players but it is also about the spirit in which this game is played that sets it apart. With that in mind I would have liked to see the IRB let Sam play in Fridays game, he deserves that much as do the other players who will take part in that game, they deserve to play against and with him on that day. C’mon IRB show some ‘spirit’.
We can argue about this all day, and no doubt it will be argued about for years to come; mark my words it will be one of the first things mentioned in four years time when the RWC comes to England.
Before I go any further, let me state for the record I am a long time supporter of Wales and a proud Welshman.
What you have to do in situations like this is analyse the facts and ensure a travesty like this doesn’t happen again.
1. Was it a penalty offence – Yes.
2. Did it deserve a Red card – Debatable? In Rolland’s eyes, yes, from the majority of the professional rugby fraternity – no, at worst a yellow card.
3. To all intents and purposes, reports state that Rolland’s is an experienced referee.
4. Has Rolland’s made bad decisions before, yes – on many occasion with people in high places calling him inept.
5. Will the IRB board stand behind – yes, especially since its lead by a fellow Irishman – was that a cheap shoot – probably.
6. Wales played with14 men against 15 for over an hour and still scored the only try.
So, lets reflect on experience. When a ref is not sure about if a try has been scored, an experienced ref would call in his line judges and most probably the TMO. Why didn’t Rolland’s do this – mmmmmm, only he can answer that! Far be it from me to comment on his part shared French ancestry; some are already saying it’s his personal crusade, because Wales took Ireland out of the world cup, I will let the “snoops” chase any financial conspiracy!
So, forget rugby for a second, taking all the above into account, ask yourself this, if you had only 3 mins to my a life changing decision but you had time to consult video evidence and were allowed to discuss this with 2 others, would you do this or would you make a split second decision?
One strange thing I noticed, and it was commented later during the ITV wash up of the incident, was that nobody realized that Sam had actually been red carded! That’s how fast Rolland’s made his mind up?
So, lets look at the IRB for a moment. When there is so much to gain and lose in a competition as this, the IRB have also to be held accountable. Would in not be prudent to have a totally neutral ref like a South African ref this match? Neither team had met Wales or France in the previous match, RSA are knocked out so there could be no cause to apply forward meeting thinking, which should by the same token rule out a Kiwi or Aussie ref.
It is further understandable that the IRB would back their ref’s for many reasons, the most, probably culminating in discipline and respect, otherwise rugby would doubtless result in the same problems as football referee’s have to suffer. However, to use a comic strip quote, “with great power comes great responsibility”. If the IRB want players to have discipline and furthermore respect their refs, they must also be prepared to defend players when travesties as obvious this happen.
So where does this put Rolland’s and the IRB? Quite simply, they have a problem. Because now, Rolland’s has set a precedent for himself, the rugby world will be watching, and every time a players lift’s another in the SAME fashion such as Sam did, Rollands surely have MUST red card them.
All said and done, the decision did play a colossal part in Wales losing, if they had had 15 men it is generally accepted by world class experienced players such as Sean Fitzpatrick, François Piennaur, Michael Lynaugh, the list could go on, that Wales would have won (see point 6 above)
But back to my opening gambit, its not going to change things so in my humble opinion, we will just have to put it down to Rolland’s being an incompetent Knob, get over it and hope he NEVER is allowed to ref such a crucial match like this ever again.
I had to get onto a Welsh website, I’ve just seen Quade Cooper go down injured in the RWC play off for 3rd place and the Welsh Players around him saw he was hurt and immediately called for help and didn’t tackle him further. You guys are absolute champions, and play the game fairly but hard. I was in Wales for the quarter final of the 1999 RWC and had the best time. Again you guys are the best.
Let’s also not forget the selection of Nigel Owens to referee one of the games in Wales’ pool which motivated an irate tweet. Not that I think for one second that Nigel would have let it sway any of his decisions; but it fuels controversey and the whining of fans.
france are a good team, why were they allowed to field 16 in a Rugby World Cup, Wales with only 14 on the field, odds were against them. Personally I believe New Zealand knew they would lose to Wales in the final – the game was fixed – shame
Dai: you’re suggesting a conspiracy where the host nation conspired to get an IRB referee (bribery?) to ensure Wales lost? Did they get to Warbuton too? He had to perform a dangerous tackle to help the referee in giving out a red card?
Do you have any evidence for this?